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Post by Ela @ GK on Oct 23, 2005 22:21:34 GMT -5
Do you think, when it comes to hexing petz, that simple hex editors like Petz Workshop is a good thing in hexing or a bad thing? Will the simple hexers replace the Old-fashions complex hexers? I want to know other's opinions on the matter of simple hex editors VS complex hexeditors.In My Opinion... (remember, we each have our own opinions ) It seems that "complex" hexers - the people who go into a program and sit for hours and hours to manipulate a mind boggling amount of unlabelled numbers to come out with a decent looking pet- are slowly being replaced (or minimized) by the "simple" hexers - The people who go into PWS and in a matter of minutes, maybe an hour tops make an equally nice looking pet-. It seems that suddenly, the people who spend hours and hours trying to create their petz on LNZ pro are nothing more than just another hexer who made a pet or two. I am happy that everyone hexes, it is a great feelign to have created your own pet, yes. I sat for days and weeks trying to understand how to hex using Reshacker and LNZ pro. I spent many tedious hours trying to get to where I am today in hexing and suddenly; All my hard work seems like nothing now that just about anyone can jump on their computer and hex a pet or breed. I am, however, happy with my own hexes because I have the gratifying feeling of knowing how much work I put into my breedz and petz. But, hey, I am happy if other people find it fun and gratifying making a pet in 5.2 seconds (figuratively speaking). I suppose, we each have our own preference in hexing - Some like keeping things the old fashioned way while some prefer to do it the quick and easy way. AFTER NOTE: I have nothing against Petz Workshop. It is a great hex editor which I used when I first began hexing.
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Post by Canni on Oct 24, 2005 2:34:55 GMT -5
I learnt on Hex Workshop which hardly anyone uses now (very time consuming lol) ... I switched to Reshacker/LNZ Pro as they are simpler and quicker... however I have fiddled with Petz Workshop because I wanted to see what it was like. Timewise...I find it much quicker to do almost everything in Reshacker, however Petz Workshop is great for fiddly things such as tattoos as I'm a uni student and don't have as much time to hex as I used too...and I like how hexing is accessible for almost anyone now, the more hexers the more choice and more different creations...though I have to say Petz Workshop has been out for awhile now and I haven't really noticed a influx of new hexers most I know of start with it then move on to Reshacker/LNZ Pro and so they still have to go through the process of learning how to hex. So I see merit in both, to tell the truth I don't see a good hexie = amount of time put into it. More the colour combo and placement and use of textures (or not)... the entire package and even with less complicated hex editors it takes more than just a program to create a great hexie, so even if they hexed it in minutes it's still cool to me.
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Post by thenickdude on Oct 24, 2005 21:40:29 GMT -5
Will the simple hexers replace the Old-fashions complex hexers? Never. Pet Workshop will never be able to let the user edit all of the complexity of the LNZ. Pro hexers with "traditional" editors will always be able to outperform Pet Workshop users for complex breeds. What's wrong with this? The truth is, that for simple operations, using a traditional editor makes as much sense as painting a picture byte by byte with a hex editor. You're just doing more work for no real gain. What really happens is that the people with no artistic talent (Like myself), who can't make breeds with a hex editor, can now make ugly breeds with Pet Workshop. The people with excellent artistic skills, but no technical skills will now be able to make excellent breeds where they couldn't before. The people with excellent artistic and technical skills will stay with traditional editors, which allow them more control, and will make the best breeds of all. But these people are in the minority.
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Post by Puppy on Oct 26, 2005 5:45:39 GMT -5
I think I am agreeing pretty much with Genuine. But mainly because I like to hex with LNZ Pro much better than PWS. I have fiddled with it, and I just don't like that program. LNZ Pro, which for me has replaced ResHacker, is a really great program. You can do much more complex things, so I don't think that the people who use PWS will ever replace the really complex hexers that use LNZPro/ResHacker. (No, I am not one of those complex hexers ) EDIT: Wait, I am not done yet, Lol. It seems like half the petz (or more) I see are beautifully hexed petz. I remember when hexed petz were rare and beautiful. I for one, can no longer appreciate a beautifully hexed pet as well as it should be because everyone is just getting better and better at hexing. A really awesome petz is no longer one that I *must* have. Wait-- was that even on topic?
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Post by Duckie on Oct 26, 2005 22:14:57 GMT -5
I actually prefer LNZ pro and reshacker compared to Petz workshop. Doing th stuff manually is much easier for me, and it takes less time. Like I find tatoos easier by writing them out.
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Post by Midnight on Oct 26, 2005 22:23:18 GMT -5
I use only LNZ Pro. I used to use Hex Workshop but I too found ResHack/LNZ Pro easier. Also, Petz Workshop makes my computer shut down so I can't use it anyway.
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Post by thenickdude on Oct 27, 2005 2:27:13 GMT -5
Even the newest version? I switched graphics engines, so unless your computer is really, really old it shouldn't have any problems.
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Post by loxfiredance on Oct 27, 2005 8:45:35 GMT -5
Personally I dont have the time or energy to sit there typing numbers into the screen which I don't even know what do; Petz Workshop has allowed me to create my own petz with ease and the guarantee of knowing EXACTLY what you're doing to breedfiles and .pet files.
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Post by (caitlin) on Nov 6, 2005 20:22:38 GMT -5
I'm not sure. Of course, you can make more complex Petz on LNZ Pro or Reshacker. I personally would love to be able to use Reshacker or LNZ Pro. I've tried for a very long time to learn how, but it seems like no matter how many tutorials I try, I just don't 'get' it- I would need someone to actually teach me.
Wow, that is COMPLETELY irrelevant!
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Post by Kovitlac on Nov 14, 2005 7:07:02 GMT -5
Me being the brilliant and very capable hexer that I am (okay, you can all go ahead and laugh, now), what I *have* been able to do has been best in Petz Workshop, as opposed to the one or two dogz hexed in hex workshop. It's easy for beginners to grasp, and is much quicker. Just because something can be done quicker or easier doesn't mean it's wrong or bad. If we all stayed in the past, we'd still be using covered wagons to get from point A to point B. If we all did things the hard way, we'd be washing clothes by hand in a bucket still. I'm not saying it's bad to hex the old way anymore. Anyone can use what they're best at. But it's nice to upgrade. After all, hexing itself is an upgrade of selective breeding. So who's to talk?
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Post by Minibyte on Nov 14, 2005 18:09:39 GMT -5
I can't resist throwing in my two cents.
First, something that kinda bugs me is that people think they are hexing when they aren't. They are using programs that do the hex editing for them. Resource Hacker is a resource manager, not a hex editor. LNZ Pro lets you edit text and then it does all the calculations to insure that the creation will work. Petz Workshop does the same but uses a graphical approach. People using these utilities ARE creating things, but they are not hex editing and they are not learning how to hex.
Second, I get really frustrated when I keep seeing posts about hex editors which refer to "all those numbers" and "unlabeled numbers." There are plenty of text comments and labels in files. You can't see them easily in a program like hex workshop and I never did understand how people could tolerate hexing a breed directing IN that program. If you extract sections of a file and save them as text files, everything gets laid out in rows and columns and there are lables across the top. That's why Carolyn's method is so wonderful. It makes it easy for a hexer to see what he/she is doing.
Third, the new programs will never take the place of a solid hex editor because there is just too much that they can't do. However, it is great that they exist because someone using a hex editor to create something very complex can use them for the easy things that are often repetitive, time consuming and extremely boring. It is not difficult to hex edit a pet with a hex editor, but it is a pain in the rear because you have to calculate and make sure the check sum and the file size are same when you finish as when you started. LNZ Pro does that tedious calculating for you and it becomes quick and easy to do simple edits of a pet file!
Conclusion? If you want something quick and easy and don't intend to become an expert hexer, use just the new programs and have fun. You can create some nice things with them. If you want to understand how hex files work, you will simply have to learn how to deal with hex editors. If you want to be really smart, you will use all the resources AND a hex editor - using different tools to do different things. If you really want to hex things that can't be done with those new resources, you simply have to buckle down, study hard and use a hex editor.
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Post by Kovitlac on Nov 14, 2005 20:03:39 GMT -5
And they are *controlling* the program, so....would that still not be hexing? Exactly how the numbers change shouldn't matter - whether a program does something or whether it's changed directly by a person - it still gets *changed*, which is my point. Even changing the simple color of a pet in Petz Workshop or any other hexing program is what I consider 'hexing' - because it's changing the origional format of the file.
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Post by Kailli @ music is life . truth on Nov 14, 2005 20:11:27 GMT -5
In MY Opinion, Many People, Such As Myself Have Lives Outside Of The Computer, And Don't Have Time For The Old Way, So I Say "Out With The Old And In With The New" There's Nothing Wrong With Either Way, But I Don't Have Just A Great Deal Of Time on My Hands.
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Post by Minibyte on Nov 15, 2005 3:13:10 GMT -5
And they are *controlling* the program, so....would that still not be hexing? Exactly how the numbers change shouldn't matter - whether a program does something or whether it's changed directly by a person - it still gets *changed*, which is my point. Even changing the simple color of a pet in Petz Workshop or any other hexing program is what I consider 'hexing' - because it's changing the origional format of the file. Ummm.... Maybe I am not being clear enough. Hexing is Hex EDITING, working directly with the hex codes. People don't do that with the programs that manipulate resources. Hex editing involves changing numbers, making sure check sums and file sizes are correct, setting appropriate pointers, etc. etc. etc. A lot of these things are extremely difficult to do, can't be done with the resource programs, and require study and skill to do them. There is nothing wrong with the new programs. Lots of people use them and like them. I just want them to understand that they are NOT hexing, that they are NOT learning how to hex, that there are a lot of things that they won't be able to do and that there are things that will require a hex editor. Actually, some excellent hexers (people who used real hex editors) are offended by people claiming that they hex when they aren't hexing. They feel that such claims cheapen their work as it ignores the hard work and study that went into learning how to edit hex coded files. To them, it is like someone coloring a picture in a coloring book and then claiming to be an artist. On the other hand, a person who hexes with a hex editor is foolish if they never use any of those programs. In some ways the resource manipulators are a great boon to hexers. Look at some of the files created by Vickie of VPZ. She adds a lot of Add Ballz to some of her breeds. When you add a lot of new stuff, the file size changes, the pointers change, all sorts of things happen that would cause the file not to work. One COULD correct everything with a hex editor, but it would take hours and hours of hair pulling, difficult calculations. A program like LNZ Pro now does those calculations and allows people to do things they couldn't easily do before. I don't know if that explains where I am coming from.... HOW the numbers/files change is crucial when you are defining something you are doing. It is important if you want to do certain things. All I am saying is that people should realize what they are doing and what they are not doing. Using correct language when communicating is very important. If you come to me, tell me you have been hexing for over a year and need to know how edit a Petz 3 plqyscene, I am going to start talking about things that have to be done with a hex editor. You are going to get a blank look on your face. LOL!
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Post by Kovitlac on Nov 15, 2005 12:24:41 GMT -5
I still consider myself to hex, no matter what program I'm using. I've done it both the old way and the new way, and I consider both to be hexing. People get offended when someone uses a new program and says they're hexing? Well I get offended when someone tells me I am NOT hexing when I'm using Petz Workshop. Who cares if it doesn't take the same amount of work? I can call myself a petz hexer if I want to, and am I lying? No. I can get things done tons faster using this method, and I don't see how it's 'not as good' who does it the older way. Not that the old way is bad - it's fine. They new way is fine. I'm not trying to argue. It's just hard to see what you mean, that's all Coming from somone who hasn't been, er, hexing very long.
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