|
Post by Inspector Caracal on May 18, 2019 12:21:30 GMT -5
Hey all! I've recently picked up Catz 4 again after *cough* *mutter*a long time*mutter* and decided I want to restart my selective breeding project from... back then.....
Anyway so Petz breeding info and guides are few and far between these days but y'all seem to be a nice active community still and I was hoping some of you might have some tips or advice about how to approach building a selective breed and how the genetics work.
It seems as though it builds in "recessive" genes by referencing previous generations, but does anyone know how far that goes back and how likely it is for a pet to pick up an ancestral "gene" rather than a parent gene? And how does it decide the color of your offspring?? I deliberately picked only the light-coat Siamese to start with and I keep getting dark-coat offspring, which has me completely perplexed.
And are there any other tips or tricks about how to choose promising offspring besides just how many of my goal characteristics they display?
I'm also trying to avoid inbreeding to reduce the chance of undesirable random mutations: is it worth it?
|
|
|
Post by Sasha on May 19, 2019 3:53:02 GMT -5
I am not a very good selective breeder, I usually just tried random things until I got what I want. But I can answer your questions relating to genetics. The most common theory on petz recessive genes is the 'invisible pet' theory, I do not know if it has been confirmed in the code but it seems to statistically match the breeding findings the best out of all breeding theories. The invisible pet theory says that every time a bred petz is born a possible sibling is also generated and saved as a second set of genes. When you breed the pet it will pass on genetics from both it's own appearance and the invisible pet. The invisible pet can contain mutations and genetics from the parents' invisible pets, so how far back the genetics go is pure luck. Adoption centre pets have invisble pets identical to themselves, so if you are getting tan coats from cream pets it must be a mutation. It's possible one of your second generations had an invisible pet's coat mutate to tan, causing them to produce tan offspring. Inbreeding has no negative consequences in petz, you may choose this for yourself. Non inbred breeding is a much harder challenge but it also makes your petz more desireable. Hope this helped and I hope an actual breeder can give you selective breeding advice! source: intron exon I believe?
|
|
|
Post by Inspector Caracal on May 19, 2019 16:40:15 GMT -5
Oh wow, that's fascinating! And complicates things enormously, doesn't it? Then again, I never expected this to be easy, haha. I have a better idea of how to identify where things are coming from now, at least, thank you!
|
|
|
Post by Kas on May 24, 2019 16:33:23 GMT -5
DISCLAIMER: I have no idea what I'm doing. All of this is my own personal experience/opinions. Am not a pro.
Having bred PB/NIB dalmatians and a mixed/inbred selective breed, this is how I understand it to work:
There's a set of 1) the pet's dominant genes, 2) the pet's recessive genes, and 3) what the pet actually looks like. All three of these sets include every physical trait of the pet (i.e. coat color, coat type, feet shape, eye lids, and so on). What's the difference? The genes (sets 1 and 2) of the parent affect the appearance of their offspring, and the appearance (set 3) of the parent does not. The appearance is only a hint of the genes a pet may carry, to help you along the way. For example, if a pet mutates to have blue eyes, but the code for blue eyes is not present in either the pet's dominant or recessive genes, then the pet won't ever produce offspring with blue eyes, with the exception of a random mutation.
The only ancestry a pet is aware of is the genes of its two parents. However, it's incredibly common for undesirable genes (i.e. a black coat, or w/e) to be carried down multiple generations, especially in challenging breeding projects. I understand how having black coats popping up left and right while breeding might make it seem like pets have some sort of complex awareness of its ancestors, but they actually don't, at least not in the way you might be thinking. Because the offspring wouldn't have black coats if you're extremely diligent (obsessive) in breeding out the coat, or any other undesirable features, but this can be very, very difficult and time consuming. There are 4 entire sets of genes you'd have to perfect in order to (almost) predictably and consistently breed the "goal" pet. I'm not saying people should go ham and make breeding their full-time job, but to put it simply, the more "sloppy" the breeding, the more likely pets are to carry old genes from, say, AC pet, to grandparent, to parent, to offspring. And by avoiding "sloppy" breeding, all I mean is, if a pet produces offspring with a highly desirable spot count, but with a coat color that's going to throw off your goal for a selfie look, weigh the pros and cons of adding it to your lines before doing so. Breed with intent, and I feel you'll reach your goals more efficiently.
TLDR: If both Mom and Dad only have poodle ears as their dominant and recessive ear type, Junior will never be born with ears other than poodle ears. But if Dad carries recessive Great Dane ears, inherited through a long chain of parents, from Bootz the AC Great Dane 10 generations ago, then Junior might get Great Dane ears from his dad. BUT (big but) Junior WON'T get it from Bootz. Junior has no idea which genes Bootz carried, only what his mom and dad carries.
Hope that helps with ancestry a bit... It's kind of hard to explain, haha. :)
|
|
|
Post by Amanda on May 25, 2019 22:51:53 GMT -5
Kas is right each pet has two complete sets of traits/genes that they can pass down (one set from each parent) as well as their own appearance (which can differ from what they are capable of passing down, I call these fluke mutations when this happens) If you don't already use it, try out GenePoolz! - reflettage.wixsite.com/yabiko/downloadI've only been using it a few months now but it's an incredibly helpful tool for breeding projects and and being able to select for desirable traits and avoid undesirable ones. From my observations, the basis of selective breeding is to look for "splits" of genes from both parents. Most of the time when you breed two petz, they inherit either Gene set A or Gene set B, unchanged, from each parent. So say if you are working with (Dane x Dali) x (Sheepie x Scottie), you can mostly end up with pups that will only have (Dane x Sheepie) or only (Dali x Scottie) and no traits from the other two breeds at all. But then, less frequently, a pup will be born that has mutated to have both sets of traits from the same parent (e.g. Dane and Dali) spliced or split together in the same gene set, instead of just the original all Dane or all Dali. It might only have Great Dane ears and otherwise all Dali traits, or be an even mix of both breeds. If you check each pup as you go you can find one that has the exact split of traits from the two original breeds that you are going for and then use that one to breed the next generation. Once you've split every breed trait that you wanted so that they all appear on the same side in GenePoolz, the hard work is done and it'll be easy to replicate since that dog's pups will no longer have to mutate in order to have all of the desired traits! And once you have Two petz with all the correct traits on one side, breed them together and some of their pups will have all the desired traits on Both sides and you now have a shape that breeds true and can focus on colors.
|
|
|
Post by Sasha on May 28, 2019 4:18:16 GMT -5
Ahhh fascinating. Seems the time for theorizing is over thanks to the wonderful Reflet. Interesting to see how the old theory holds up to the facts. So there are two invisible pets? And the appearance does not count? Fascinating, fascinating.
|
|